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Updated 10.30
PERMANENT TSB AND Springboard Mortgages have written to 1,372 mortgage holders to inform them about “serious failures” in the management of their loans.
According to a statement from the firms today, up to 61 homeowners who were impacted by the mistakes in interest rates charged lost their properties.
As many as 22 of those people may have avoided this situation and kept their homes had the failures not occurred.
As part of the redress scheme announced today, those who lost ownership of their home will receive compensation payment of €50,000. If the property was a buy-to-let, the compensation will be reduced to €25,000.
In cases where PTSB’s failure was a “key factor”, any monies still owed by the customer on the mortgage account will be written off.
An investigation by the Central Bank revealed that other customers may also have “suffered serious consequences as a result of the failures”.
These effects included:
The events occurred after homeowners lost their contractual right to a tracker rate because of the failures in the management of the accounts.
PTSB chairman Alan Cook and CEO Jeremy Masding have apologised to the customers, saying the failure was “deeply regrettable”.
“The failures which occurred have had very serious consequences for impacted customers and we apologise unreservedly on behalf of the Group to them and to all our customers,” they said.
We are truly sorry that this has occurred and our absolute focus now is on correcting the position of every impacted customer as speedily as possible.
With a particular focus on those who lost their homes, the executives added:
We acknowledge that the bank’s failure may have been a factor in events that ultimately led to some customers losing the property linked to the mortgage. We will do everything in our power to help these customers.
The customers impacted include 1,152 PTSB loan holders and 220 Springboard Mortgage Limited customers.
Colette Browne / TwitterIf I lost my home because of Permanent TSB I'd be telling them to stick their compensation and suing.
— Colette Browne (@colettebrowne) July 28, 2015
Back in the black
The bank’s admission came as it reported its first half-year profit since 2007. It just snuck into the black with an underlying return of €1 million over the six months to the end of June, although that was before once-off charges of €432 million.
The result was a turnaround from the €171 million loss it recorded for its core business for the same period in 2014.
Just under 75% of the bank remains in taxpayer hands after a share sale in April and about 40% of its mortgage customers are still in arrears.
A redress scheme
Meanwhile, a Mortgage Redress Programme will be established to offer compensation to those affected and customers are being asked to consider their options in respect of tracker interest rates.
For all Springboard customers, an incorrect rate was applied to accounts so redress and compensation will be paid. They have since been moved to the correct rate.
The initial failure was when PTSB failed to inform certain customers fully of the consequences of their decisions to break from a fixed rate or discounted tracker rate early.
Other customers had a contractual right to be offered a tracker rate at the end of any fixed rate period. However due to a failure by permanent tsb that option was not communicated to them at the end of their fixed rate period.
The errors with the accounts occurred between 2006 and 2011.
Additional reporting Peter Bodkin
First published 9.05am
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Oh, so they get their houses back then?
Can you also ‘imagine’ the emotional distress from all of this ?
With the quotes around the word imagine, I’m not sure if this is sarcasm or not. There is a huge amount of emotional distress caused by it.
This is only half the story…..springboard Mortgages was a joint venture between permanent Tsb and Merill Lynch. Yes the same Merill Lynch who were fined hundreds of millions of dollars for exploiting people with sub prime loans in the states and the same Permanent we bailed out with taxpayers money when they screwed up. Oh did I mention the same Merill were paid for advice the week of the bank guarantee by the government. 3.8 million euro for about 3 days work. They left the market and stopped lending sub primes when they got into hot water in the states but what did Permanent do….they sold the Springboard loans to Mars Capital earlier this year , essentially a vulture fund looking to make a killing. So these finding are only scratching the surface of the skulduggery that these institutions have been up to , sub prime loans were given at extraordinarily high interest rates in the knowledge that there would be defaults on the loans and they would seek repossession , I’m delighted to hear people who did go thru the legal nightmare. Are getting balances written off but I’d like to see far stiffer punishments for the guys responsible for the outrageous behaviour , I won’t hold my breath.
Just an honest mistake,OU812 :(
This is a horrendous thing to have happened to these families -and the psychological damage that this has done will be huge ..
Apologies if I have caused offence as none was intended .
What is wrong with the world nowadays ? People will do anything to make money and let people suffer taking their homes off them just to make extra money, suppose these people have to answer to their maker when that day comes, by God I wouldn’t like to be them
they take ur home and throw u out,everything that these poor people worked so hard to buy and make a life for themselves and their families and they are offered €50,000,it’s a disgrace, they should be bought a house by the bank and help them to rebuild their lives, I hope none of these people took their own lives because of the bank,no accountability
Ten people have given this comment a red thumb…..what F*****G. planet are they on….what is in this comment that you don’t agree with….perhaps its the “stiffer punishments for the guys responsible”…. honestly I despair of some people at times…
Lets not forget those who’s marriages broke up over extra financial hardship, or those who took or attempted to take their own lives because they could see no way out, the kids of families who had to go without for years, the ones who were hit by bank charges because standing orders bounced with the burden of higher than normal payments.
How about those who couldn’t afford to buy food, or didn’t turn on the heat for an extra couple of weeks in winter, people who are now on medication for depression or blood pressure… people who’s credit ratings were destroyed… All because the mortgage was prioritised.
This bank & it’s management intentionally defrauded these people. Not one of them will see jail or any penalty.
I’ve been affected by this, as well as someone else I know. It’s been six years now. I’ll never get that time back, nor will my family. I’m glad it’s coming to an end, but there’s a very bitter taste in my mouth.
What about the people still in their homes who have struggled to keep them but were never informed about the tracker option at the end of the fixed rate period? Can they now change?
What are the consequences for PTSB and it’s senior staff? Resigning matter at least and legal proceedings? Seriously? Are these legitimate errors, or are they being labelled errors because one way or another the facts were going to emerge at this time? Irish banks have a long history of accidents with the customers loosing out.
Wont be long before we hear how low moral is in the bank, maybe they should double the bonus, that the solution to all their issues …
Well said. It’s notable that the ubiquitous “errors” which occur in the corporate world would be categorized as fraud if perpetrator and victim were reversed.
This is a mistake that would have been made by a low level accountant or programmer.
Not the cigar smoking menace you seem to be envisaging.
Obviously it’s a terrible mistake, but anger at individuals for a mistake offers no solace.
The punishment is the same it’s always been, if i was getting a mortgage today, I’d stay clear of a company who can make such an error.
Ciaran,
The Libor rate was not rigged by low level accountants or programmers. That’s just one recent example of a tsunami of fraud. The global financial/banking sector is systemically corrupt and exploitative with almost daily revelations of “errors” which invariably benefit the corporation at the expense of the ordinary individual.
To ge ta sense of this, here’s a few extracts from an article from the U.S last year titled.
“The Financial Sector Is the Greatest Parasite in Human History”
http://neweconomicperspectives.org/2014/03/financial-sector-greatest-parasite-human-history.html
• In economics, the financial sector is typically lumped in with the insurance sector and real estate (the financial portion of the real estate sector, not construction) sector. Together, the sectors are often abbreviated and called the FIRE sector. In this article I will talk mainly about the finance portion of the FIRE sector since it is by far the largest, most visible, and most corrupt.
• The problem is that the financial, insurance, and real estate (FIRE) sectors do not actually produce any goods or services.
• The job of the finance sector is simply to manage existing resources. It creates nothing. Therefore, the smaller the financial sector is the more real wealth there is for the rest of society to enjoy. The bigger the financial sector becomes the more money it siphons off from the productive sectors.
• But wait! There’s more! Mutual funds and your average retail investor are relatively unsophisticated, so a new industry has popped up to take advantage of them. It’s called “high frequency trading” or HFT for short. These are powerful computers programmed to take advantage of “dumb” traders in the market. These HFT firms place their computers physically next to the stock exchange computers in the datacenters and buy access to market quotes milliseconds before they are made public. They use these and other advantages to skim profits from other legitimate investors (that is, people buying stocks because they want to own part of the underlying company).
• In 2012, hedge funds removed $50.5B from their investors’ pockets. In fact, according to an article in Jacobin Magazine, the top 25 hedge fund managers make more money than the CEOs of all S&P 500 companies combined. Combined!
• First, over 10 years the returns for hedge funds are atrocious, only about 25% in total.
• Speculation by the financial sector in the commodities market is impacting the entire world. The passage of the Commodities Futures Modernization Act (CFMA) has allowed big banks to engage in almost limitless speculation in the commodities market.
• An executive for MillerCoors testified that manipulation of the aluminum market cost manufacturers over $3B. The World Bank estimated that in 2010, 44 million people worldwide were pushed into poverty because of high food prices. The chief cause? More than 100 studies agree the cause is speculation in the commodities market. (Goldman Sachs made $440M in 2012 from food market speculation.) For Americans who love their cars (and SUVs), the biggest impact might be felt at the gas pump where experts estimate that financial speculation has added anywhere from $1 to $1.50 to gas prices.
• One significant source of profit for the financial sector has been exploiting public, taxpayer-owned infrastructure. It should be blatantly obvious that these deals are bad for citizens, as the fees charged to citizens for use of the asset must not only cover servicing costs and maintenance capital expenditures but must also generate profit for the firms buying the assets.
• As the financial sector funnels more and more resources into lobbying and bribes (let’s face it, campaign contributions are nothing more than legal bribery), it has been able to strip an ever-greater amount of state-owned assets from the public. Public asset strip mining is one of the chief causes of the increasing profitability of the financial sector.
• I highly doubt any of my clients or readers are beneficiaries of the SNAP or “food stamps” program and are probably not very familiar with it. While it is nominally a government program it has been corrupted by the big banks. Benefits are provided electronically via debit cards (EBT cards). JP Morgan has made over $500M from 2004 to 2012 providing EBT benefits to 18 states. The banks then are free to reap fees from users for such things as cash withdraws for TANF benefits, out of network ATM fees, lost card replacement fees, and even customer service calls.
• I believe you can judge how profitable a service is to a company how much it spends on lobbying. In the case of JPMorgan, its bribes, I mean campaign contributions to Agriculture Committee (SNAP is part of the Department of Agriculture) members increased sharply after it entered the EBT market in 2004.
• The financial sector is a parasite that depends on its host organism, the productive sector of the economy, to fuel its profits. The larger the financial sector grows, the more wealth it extracts from the productive sectors of the economy. With all due respect to Matt Taibbi, Goldman Sachs isn’t a vampire squid; the entire financial sector is the vampire squid with its tentacles reaching into the pockets of citizens everywhere and sucking out money.
Reading on the Breaking news site, it is reported that 61 people lost their homes, can’t help wondering how many more may have been forced out of their homes under duress, shameful and 50,000 compensation will not address this situation, criminal what has happened to these poor people.
Too right Andy. The 50,000 isn’t enough for the mental hardship these people needlessly suffered over a long period of time. Even if senior management were not directly responsible for the error, they have a duty to implement systems to ensure that people do not lose their homes due to an error by their company. The damage to people and families as a result of such an error is huge, up to and including suicide due to the stress of losing your home. This doesn’t interest the banks though as it won’t affect them financially, and they can throw a few cheques for 50,000 around afterwards. The financial regulator, government and courts system exist to protect banking and business. The common man is on their own here.
Ciaran, I understand your point. I was being sarcastic though about senior management resigning. The point is that it is senior management usually in banks who do the damage in terms of policies that lead to PTSB having the highest number of tracker mortgages in the Irish banking industry and then serious pressure to get as many of their customers transferred to other mortgage terms, which leads ultimately to these kinds of consequences.
the homeowners will have to stick together and refuse the compensation. sue ptsb for everything the law will allow. these parasites are just as ruthless and would do the same to you. if they are offering 50k you can be sure that legally your entitled to much much more.
We call it the ministry for justice, it’s not, it is the ministry for law. You have no chance of justice in this country if your claim upsets the powerful. claims made against government bodies eg. Hse .banks, gardai, schools,local authorities ect.are paid by the state the state being you the tax payer. Nothing comes out of the pockets of the people who are responsible so who cares.
No that PTSB have admitted liability those poor home owners should launch legal action against them.
The offer of €50,000 will invariably be accompanied by a disclaimer.
Depending on the personal circumstances those who lost property may be able to claim for full market value..
It’s an offer of €50k if you lost your home, not if you’re still in it, but I agree with you, they should be responsible for the full value of the property. People’s lives (as well as their money) were stolen.
Yep, and emotional trauma does have a distinct value in this case. Bout time this industry accepted full liability for its actions, maybe then they wouldn’t be so quick to referb all their high street outlets and pay massive bonuses.
Stress, loss of sleep, worry, emotional pain. any good lawyer would be rubbing his hands and looking for at least a million
we are sorry and deeply regrettable that we got caught ERM oops I mean that you lost your home because we wanted as many repossessions as possible from those tracker mortgages!
Bankers rule the world they do what they want. Gov and judiciary back them up. FG Alan Shatter made it EASIER for banks to reposess. Gov represent banks and big business and police protect them not us. One big club and we ain’t in it.
Oh I’m sure those people will be delighted .
more like greed rather than mistakes
We’ll give you money which isn’t ours to cover the mistakes we made but we’ll make up for it by charging the remaining mortgage holders more interest.
That’s deplorable. Yet again systematic failures in a bank and it’s highly likely no one will be held accountable.
Someone cooked the books. Will he / she be made accountable. Not likely. The thoughts of having lost your house to the greed of bankers who you had only just bailed out. Sickening…..
Does anyone else not agree that 50000 euros is no where near enough to compensate people who have lost their homes. The emotional stress alone is worth more considering the compensation that some people get nowadays!
They should be compensated with the value of the property, nothing less.
No way. These people probably had to sell/ give away furniture etc. they will also have to refurbish any new house they buy. Also what about all the money the forked out for legal fees. They deserve that money returned. There are a lot of expenses you seemed to have forgotten about!
These banking mistakes always in favour of the banks, they are compensating 50k for the trauma and dehumiliation of been incorrectly kicked out of your home and maybe loosing good friends, schools and neighbours. Disgraceful. I’d be at my solicitor now and humiliate the bank.
Is this the same PTSB that facilitated a very dodgy ‘hiding’ of certain monies in conjunction with Anglo Irish? Nobody seems to have been sanctioned for this arrangement. In fairness it was conducted under the former Chairperson of PTSB.
Their “serious failures” and “mistakes” always benefits the bank, the same way a burglar make off with your TV is a mistake.
Yes RBS proved that, it isn’t like their mistake cost them any money.
Very interesting the way it is being spun on RTE as a story about 1,400 people receiving a windfall compensation payment.
Somehow I don’t think a new current account and a free pen will make them feel any better
USC, HOUSE TAX, WATER TAX, HIGHER PRICES FOR JUST ABOUT EVERYTHING. CUTS FOR JUST ABOUT EVERYTHING. LOSS OF HOMES. EMIGRATION. SUICIDES. DEPRESSION. Etc..
FG/LAB ASSISTING THE PAYMENTS FOR BANKERS GAMBLING DEBTS AND A FAILING CURRENCY.
And yee are sorry.
F##k off.
The British landlords who get the bad rap for evictions in this country let people stay in their homes if they paid . Fast-forward 2016 The merchant bankers throw you out anyway. Progression well we have I pads I suppose.
Based on the sample checking by the CBI, it is likely that these mistakes and the loss of 22 home represents the top of the ice berg.
This is a massive political, regulatory and financial failure.
So much for Ireland in 2015 and its planned celebrations of the Eater Rising in 2016.
Ireland does lip service and hypocrisy exceedingly well.
22 families made homeless and they choose to publish this in mea culpa fashion…
Ok, so the Central Bank is making them play it this way, but for anyone who was arguing all along that the rates being demanded were incorrect and now finds themselves vindicated it must be a nightmare.
Firstly, what is being offered in compensation is derisory.
Secondly, solicitors who would have been involved in pushing such cases before the courts should be held to account. The Nuremburg Defence (“I was only following orders”) should not be allowed to apply to people who were paid to deprive these people of the right to enjoy their property.
Thirdly, the courts who did this. No responsibility?
Like Collette Browne, I’d tell the bank to stuff their compensation and sue.
I’m sure it is a total coincidence this story finally comes out just minutes after the Eurostat report on Irish Water…………..
These people should initiate a class action against this bank, not just for loss of their property but for emotional distress, mental stress etc. time for the boyos in this bank to be turfed out for monumental incompetence.
It’s crazy how the CEO’s of these companies can walk away with “I’M SORRY” after putting financial hardship onto families. Enda Kenny did say he would hold these people accountable in his vote for me campaign/lies. When are we going to wake up.
These poor people need to join together and day after day release their story into media one at a time to highlight the horrific nature of what has happened they should also join together in legal pursuit of this bank which is hanging by a thread as it is…. Sickening that this comes out now that they have been FOUND OUT time for everyone to drill down into their bank dealings and look at all loans I’d imagine there is a lot more to come on this one …….,
What about personal loans ????
If people started digging they’d prob be horrified
If they stopped “mistaking” money out of customers accounts in 2011, when did they realise it was the wrong thing to do and how long have they been strategising a media response?
sue sue sue, the bollox out of they
I’m sure there’ll be plenty of empty apologies and they can all get back to business, nothing to see here move along move along
Sue the dirty rotten BA$TARDS
Staggering admission.
Anxious to see who the first Minister will be to claim quodos for helping those poor unfortunate morgage holders out.
not good enough!! lost their homes, sorry here’s 50k!
And us mugs on Variable rate mortgages will be footing the bill for their “mistakes” and “errors” the same as ever.
Christt Almighty what type of Gobshiites are running this country ! Politicians / Bankers / Regulators / Church.!!!!!
they are not the only bank screwing up mortgage repayments. Get independent advice if such a thing exists .
Total disgrace. Utter shambles. Am disgusted to read how those poor customers were treated.
I saw the 1 O’Clock RTE TV interview with the PTSB boss,he did’nt appear to be very distressed over the damage caused by his bank to its customers.Goes to show that the Banks are as detached from people’s lives as ever.I hope the affected customers of PTSB give this Bank hell !!!!!!
They should be made buy houses and pay the mortgage in full for anyone who lost their home as a result of this debacle.
I feel so blessed to live in a country that cannot stop apologising to me. Bankers politicians n public servants just keep saying sorry. To all of you may I suggest somewhere dark and personal to stick your apologies. Sorry for any offence.
€50,000 /€25,000 is a derisory offer. Go to a good solicitor and get proper compensation.
How many people who are currently customers will close their accounts because of the treatment of these people. That is the only way to hurt PTSB. I assume you must have a licence of some description to operate a bank in this Country. If so, notice should be given immediate that the PTSB licence will be revoked within a sensible time frame unless the the people who lost their homes are fairly compensated, ie new comparable homes at the old mortgage rates they were paying prior to the error and whatever monies they had paid off their old mortgage to be written off the new mortgage. Immediately the full board should hand in their notice to resign over the next 12 months. The senior management team who were responsible for the Department that made the mistake should also be asked to resign with immediate effect.
To me that seems fair.
As a matter of interest, whilst not having seen the full report of the AGM I wonder how many ordinary shareholders were up in arms at this news and called for heads to roll. I bet very few as society is moving towards the “I am ok jack, tough sh*t on you”
Is it just me or does Alan cook being remorseful in the picture look like Adolf cook with his salute to the masses
This so called bank should be prosecuted
unacceptable
Ah they’re sorry… ah well tat makes it ok then….. Who gets away with not so much as a slap on the wrist this time? Ya have to love these irish banks… honest to jaysis!!!!!!
Sounds fab. Fifty grand for the heartbreak of being turfed out in the street? Hope they don’t get too excited.
I think some had strokes… Are any dead as 50k will not cure them?
Who’s watch was this all done on???
Appalling!
Wonder how long it will be before they bring in proper fees like other banks. Only a fool would expect to get something for free, any business has to make money somewhere and if they had charged properly for current accounts they wouldn’t be under so much pressure to make money from mortgages.
Looks like a Nazi in that photo…
Here is what PTSB can do…
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/skeleton-alien-skull-discovered-russia-132815090.html?vp=1#1LpXWbC
Any ideas?
“Sorry” is not much consolation….
Next big storey EUROPEAN COURT OF JUSTICE case number C41/15 the company streamrolling over the rights of 135000 (THOUSAND) investers lets see if Masding retires then!!!
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