Now that most of the cards are on the table, the one which has the most to loose will have no choice but to blink.

The ECB are only trying to make them selves look good. The Cypriot prime minister said he wants it sorted today.

* president not PM

I think Cyprus are going to make the ECB look like the fools they are, Good luck to them.

Cyprus will loose this game of chicken

From the Financial Times:

President Nicos Anastasiades will now come under intense pressure in Europe to go back to the idea of imposing a heavier levy on bigger depositors while exempting all those with accounts under €100,000. It means hitting the island’s Russian clients hard, and international lenders have been taken aback by the extent to which Cyprus’s political classes have defended foreign depositors. As one noted, in most countries it is the locals that politicians worry about. Apparently not in Cyprus. As Erik Nielsen of UniCredit argues, depositors in Cyprus have benefited from higher rates of interest than elsewhere in the eurozone:

As Erik Nielsen of UniCredit argues, depositors in Cyprus have benefited from higher rates of interest than elsewhere in the eurozone:
“A Cypriot (or foreigner) who placed €100,000 in deposit in Cyprus in 2008 would by now have earned just around €15,000 more than if he had placed that money in Italy or Spain (and some €23,000 more than if he had placed it in Germany). Why does the Cypriot parliament (and many commentators) seem to suggest that a 15 per cent tax on such deposits (which would cover the bill also for the sub-€100,000 deposits) would be unreasonable now the banks are in trouble, but that German, Italian and other eurozone taxpayers should rather foot the bill? To me, the Cypriot position is simply unsellable in the rest of the eurozone.”

@Goban, absolutely right. The government in Cyprus is trying to get support from the people at home and in other EU countries by making the EU look evil; and until now it is working. But the longest this lasts, the more information comes out, and the most unsustainable it is going to become.

When people in most european countries realise that the government of Cyprus is protecting offshore depositors and not the locals; and that even with the deposit tax, these people are getting more interests for their money than depositors of the other EU countries which are required to bail out the banks; then the game will end quickly.

Oh my word the longer it is going out the more bloody spin you are hearing and falling for, this report about the amount of Russian oligarchs having billions their is madness we have no proof of the amount, the report was done by German secret agency , no one is allowed see the report, no one ever will according to the German on vin b last night. So what we are meant to just believe these Germans who we don’t know and who won’t show us proof. Then you have economists saying it is actually only a tiny percentage that are Russians. I don’t trust what Germany says.
When will people wake up they were going to hit ordinary depositors and they nor the Irish gov cared or saw anything wrong with that. My money is out of the bank and its going to stay that way. Enda Michael parties would have agreed to this no problem and deep down ye all know it.

@Adelle, it is not only reports from secret services AND financial institutions, it also comes directly from these people: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/mar/18/russia-unfair-cyprus-bank-levy

If there was no or little money, I don’t think we would have seen Putin, then Medvedev, and then a number of wealhy Russians people condeming the tax as unfair.

Very true.

The household charge is also ripping people off what is the matter with the people allowing the government to tax people who are struggling to pay mortgages we should be telling them No No No as loud as it needs to be this property tax is wrons as is going into people’s bank accounts Well done Cyprus

You could take money from the bank accounts in Ireland (as they did when they raided the private sector pension funds) and there wouldn’t be any uproar either. The difference isn’t really that people don’t understand, it’s the blind trust in our betters and lack of self sufficiency/responsibility/respect that caused us to vote for the fiscal compact. The Cypriots are showing they have greater strength of character than the Irish sheep. They are in a tough situation, and I hope they find a way out of it.

The US came up with something like 60-65 billion in emergency funds for the affected States in the aftermath of hurricane Sandy. They didn’t even blink, even though the Fed is facing some tough budget decisions.

It will be pretty funny if Russia ends up bailing Cyprus out. A few more like this and the eurozone is dead (disclaimer: I generally support the euro and the European project – but the EU “leaders” are doing their best to kill it off)

Same way we did when the Bank staff went on strike for six months.

If you want to know how the situation in Cyprus will progress then look at what happened in Argentina. It’s true that people ran out of money, food and fuel. The preppers in the states get slagged for scenarios like this but everyone is right to prepare for economic disasters and people in Ireland should do the same just in case.

This is why we need to stop using banks to hold our money. Instead of gettin paid into your bank account get paid by the cash your employer makes. Cut the bank out all together in everyway possible. Everytime i get paid i withdraw everything

I heard a reporters on al-Jazzera this morning saying that he had just been talking to a man who had bought a newspaper in a shop and got his change in the form of chocolate bars.

And will go down on history as the biggest mistake…..the destruction in its wake will be seen for ever more.

You can dress it up how ever you want the euro is collapsing.

The euro elite will do eveything in their power to save their euro pet project. Most leaders would realise it was a mistake and throw in the towell.

But the euro elite would rather see the ordinary citizens of Greece, Cyprus etc suffer than admit their mistake

Bailouts are actually ILLEGAL under the Maatricht treaty but the EU don’t care about legalities – they will do anything to save their baby, their creation.

The Greek PM suggested a referendum on the euro and he was deposed within weeks! Berlusconi was also deposed in a coup because he was not bringing in cutbacks fast enough to save the euro. Massive Italian debt is threatening the euro

The euro led to ridiculously low interest rates here, (to suit the German economy), and fuelled a property bubble, which the TAXPAYERS are now paying for. “Bailouts” are actually bailing out the bondholders not the ordinary people

Greece, Cyprus etc are locked into a monetary union, they would thrive with their own lower currencies – that is why the euro elite dont want them to leave! Because all the other countries would follow them.

The euro is soaring against sterling at the moment and hitting our exports to Britain. We would not have that problem if we had our own weaker punt

I agree that the euro masters are manipulating the stability of the euro, but 6 years on and no solution. If they did truly want to save it, they would have by now.

This shambles of a currency is perfectly devised and planned down to a T.

Either it’s way out of their control and it self destructs OR we see the bigger nations taking full control in
A) a two tiered EZ or
B) a smaller EZ with just the big guns.

Having said that, it’s clear from the actions of so called leaders that they’re not prepared to look out for the average European in which case I ask when is it viable to ask the whole of Europe’s citizens if they want in or out.

The euro project has veered off course and its not what it was set out to be. It will not end well.

The prudent people of Holland, Finland don’t seem to have a problem. The Club Med countries will always be basket cases. Any country that can organise a pizz up in a brewery has bigger issues.

“The euro elite will do eveything in their power to save their euro pet project”

No they won’t. What exactly have they done to save the euro?

Merkel does not appear to be a fan. The EU has been in react-mode ever since this thing started, and is not living up to its responsibilities.

Bill little guy with savings over 100.000 , please make me a little guy,

Shay, take off your shoes. That should drop you about half an inch, after that you’re on your own. :-)

Shay, the first plan Cyprus suggested would have included all deposits, regardless of the amount, and the one which was brought to parliament was for all deposits above 20000 euros.

Even at that level, it wasn’t just the rich …

No , but 10percent is the pay cuts offered to some public servants here, nurses and Guards,

Am I the only one who would rather have paid a once of 10% on my cash than be shouldered with the long term legacy Irish taxpayers have been left with?

One principle I would also prefer a once of payment.

I think 2 thinks make it a hard sale:
- the situation there is MUCH worse than it was in Ireland before the bailout, so there will be a double dip: once off payment and also what Ireland is getting; so people try to avoid anything they can (which is fair enough)
- if you take even a small amount from someone’s bank account, they will cry foul when they see their personal money gone. Don’t touch their account but inflate the national debt to a point that will personally cost them and they children much more unless they emigrate – and they’ll be fine.

But one thing to keep in mind: there is an option not to hit depositors below 100000 euros. That effectively is a way to spare most of the population from the once off charge and hit the bankers and international finance.

But it’s not just that – its deposit theft to raise 5 billion in order to qualify for a loan of a further 10 billion that still requires tax/cuts/austerity.

@goban

Paul true, but some of those people have their money in Cyprus to avoid tax on their own country,
10 percent of their cash may be a warning Ro pay your share
Maybe

Our lot are more of a cash for gold type of chav.

Come on james , learn to read between the lines ,
If cyprus had come up with the proposal to tax the lower deposits ………would they have voted in favour for their own prosposal’s .
This is more dirty tricks by the eu/imf ,
It was their proposal , hence the reason everyone in the cypriot parliment said NO.

Yes the original EU/IMF proposal was 15.6% on over 100K only and as only 100K is guaranteed anyway it was a reasonable suggestion.
However the Cypriot government did not want to upset the Russian Oligarchs who funnel all their dirty money into the banks there, so they insisted it be applied to all depositors so the rate on those over 100K could be reduced.
They have since been furiously spinning it as something imposed upon them.
At this point they should be kicked out of the Euro to serve as an example, convert all money in their banks to cypriot pounds and unleash the currency markets on it.
After it’s thoroughly devalued they may look back longingly on the offer to lose only 15%.

Denis how niave are you ,
Do you really think if cyprus signed up to the eu bullies , that they would only lose 15%,

.
Ther would be a gauranteed run on the banks in cyprus ……probably to the point of collapse.
.
its all a ploy , to get cyprus back to the table with the gas reserves a bartering tool …….and play right into the eu hands .
.
Of course due to subliminal bigotry of the media this will never be reported in full .
Never let fact get in the way of a good story ,right..
.
.by the way mwrkel and co don,t have aproblem with russian “so called dirty money” when they are purshasing thousands of bmw,s mercs, and audi,s every year

@sean

But its not even clear at this stage whether those gas reserves are Cyprus’s at all, they lie right on the line with Israeli waters don’t they? And hasn’t Turkey already said that if Cyprus tries to develop these fields they would send in their war ships? Its not always the big bad EU to blame but as you said yourself “never let fact get in the way of a good story” or in your case conspiracy.

Premeditated? Do you realise their banks are bust? There is no cash left due to giving out dodgy loans.

The Cypriots could have exempted the accounts over 100k but their government chose to save their Financial Services industry and help out their dodgy Russian friends.

” There is no cash left due to giving out dodgy loans.”

Actually there was a certain amount of contagion from Greece due to them burning bondholders (with the ECB’s approval)

Did the ECB know that Cyprus was put at risk by that burning?

So the troika caused the Cypriots problem by telling Greece to burn them 18 months ago, then publicly told them to burn depositors or their banks would close, all done over a bank holiday weekend.

Now that Cyprus are franticly looking at other options, they are giving deadlines to accepting the $hitty end of the stick further upping the pressure. Why?

And its all in the same style of our pressured deposit guarantees and deals in the middle night.

You’re right, probably just a coincidence. How could the troika’s financial experts have guessed it would cause bank runs and headline news across Europe all week.

Cyprus is half the size of Dublin a perfect example for the troika to set as another example of what will happen when you do crazy things like vote the wrong way.

Forgive me if I’m overly suspicious but this stinks!

so it’s the ECB’s fault Cypriot banks gave risky loans to Greece in the first place?

“burning” the bondholders was recognizing the inevitable – that Greece couldn’t and wouldn’t pay. If the Cypriot banks had proper risk management in place and hadn’t been so reliant on high risk lending to Greece to fund the high deposit rates they paid they wouldn’t be in this mess.

Next thing you’ll be blaming ECB for making Anglo give loans to developers.

The chances are there’s more than one factor at play.

Contagion from Greece wasn’t helpful.

Or do you only belive in single causes?

Who’s next after Cyprus?

(btw wouldn’t want to be the guy who lent the Russian mafia’s money to Greece)

Nail on the head jenny , we are in the midst of economic war ……….for cyprus , the gas reserves is the imf,s ultimate prize , but off course they ain,t going to outright admit it ,
What they are waiting for is a bailout offer thats will include % of the gas reserves ,

This the thing that has happened in africa tine and again , where the ultimate prize was the natural resources ,
WWIII in full effect,

The banks who own most big corporations want our and the rest of EU and Middle Easts natural resources.

Then they will own everything ,people with mortgages out there you are now a debt slave, people in trouble with mortgages they are controlling your finances you have to give them every detail of what goes in and out and I mean every detail, then they will take the max they can and leave you with so little that you can just about eat and keep warm actually most can’t, they have taken your life and made it a mere nothing of an existence.

Remember you don’t own your home, you have a contractual right to live in that home and the Irish government are passing legislation to make it easier for the banks to get your home( asset grabbing, banks will be our landlords in the future) so banks + corporations will own our land, water, oil, food supply, forests, gas, gold etc and they will own us because we owe them.

What kind of a world will future generations be living in. Scary thought.

The Euro was set up to serve the central banking elite and nobody else. The currency is not backed by anything other than the willingness of governments to impose it on their people as “legal tender” and to take more and more of the product of their labour in the form of taxes to pay the interest.

That our corp tax rate would increase if the gov could not make up a shortfall should a second crisis occur.

Corporation tax rate is for our own companies
Multinationals don’t pay the rate here or anywhere
Wish people would stop spouting this rubbish that multinationals come here for our rate of corporation tax rate

What so the ECB should funnel money into their broke banks unconditionally?

Thus completing the final stage of our transition to being a communist state. Will we build a palace for Enda like the one that Ceauşescu had?

@censored So tell me, when did we start our transition from being a fascist state, where the debts of private enterprises are dumped on the taxpayer, but their profits are kept private, to being a communist state?

The hard Russian people I know do not have in excess of € 100,000 to put into a bank in a foreign country in which they do not live.

These deposits were what the EU contingent were targeting.

Targeting smaller deposits was the brainwave of the Cypriot contingent, and the Cypriot contingent alone.

It was a case of the Cypriot contingent putting their clients ( the Russian oligarchs, not the Russian people as whole ) ahead of the Cypriot citizens.

Mafia or not mafia. The reality is that there is no line at all between Russia mafia, Russian oligarchs and the Russian politicians currently in power ( aka Putin & co. )

Commenter who persist in ignoring basic facts in order to feed their rabid Euro-hatred cannot be taken seriously. It is willful ignorance on the level of the BNP, UKIP etc.

It’s a terrible pity that people in Ireland are sinking to the level of populist rabble-rousing bigots. I honestly thought, As a nation, we were better than that.

Nikolas, it seems that you are very distant from reality! Wake up mate! Of course it’s ordinary Russian people (plus some oligars) keep some of their hard earned money in Cyprus! Russia traditionally has the highest employment level in Europe and thus Russians earn a lot of money, which they prefer to keep offshore. I have a lot of Russian friends and I can tell you they are very clever and impressively well educated people. No wonder they are so rich!! STOP BEING JEALAOUS! IT’S DISGUSTING!

So it’s normal and typical that the hard working common man has over € 100,000 to salt away in an off-shore bank account.

Your definition of the common man is not mine.

I normally shy away from actively insulting people on this site, as it has a tendency to cheapen the argument, but, as you’re no aversion to insulting people yourself, I’ll ask you a question and make an observation.

What’s in it for you in defending a bunch of extremely rich elitists who made their money by seizing the Russian assets and resources post-collapse, and who are part and parcel of a regime who regularly imprision those who speak out against that regime? What’s your angle.

And now the observation; people who blatantly ignore basic facts when repeatedly presented with them pop up at regular intervals. Sometimes they’re called flat-earthers. Sometimes they’re called creationists. Usually they’re just a rent-a-revolt ( any issue will do, we don’t care! ) and when a certain amount appear at a single time and place, they tend to actively aid and assist the rise of a fascist, anti-humanist, anti-freedom, anti-progressive regime.

And now I’ll stop holding the mirror in front of your face and go out for a quick pint.

All your championing here is the lowest-common-denominator. You have no interest in improving things, you just want others to be as disenfranchised as you feel you are.

Stop projecting your perceived failures into other peoples, they didn’t ask for it and they don’t deserve it.

@Nikolas Much of the Russian money in Cypriot banks is government money and represents a part of Russia’s euro reserves.

@ Nikolas ; just 3 questions for clarity,
1. Have you ever read the irish Constitution.
2. There was a contention made on an Irish Television programme that the german constitution has within it the desire to “expand it’s borders” (this phrase is the best I could do of memory and please don’t get insulted I believe in open honest dialogue) do you know if this is true ?
3. When was the last time that germany was ruled by an outside power ?
Our history is not german history, we are Irish, I ask these questions based on your name and your insight on an earlier post that praised the reputation of Kerrygold in germany which made me assume that you are german. If this assumption is incorrect then please forgive me!

@ Nikolas ; appologies for the ommision of the capital “G” no insult intended ! I would have corrected but I was a bit quick with the submit button!